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 Post subject: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:38 pm 
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Seriously. I'm going insane. I just destroyed an entire sheet of 12 of the exact same logo for my fuzz builds to sell at our next show (Saturday night). The prototype went on like a dream first try. I have no idea what changed, but I've got nothing to show for the last hour or trying to decal the same pedal over and over and over.

I'm have clear vinyl stickers printed locally tomorrow and if that isn't fast enough I'm just taking a sharpie to the damn things and calling it hand-made art.

It's been a frustrating day of never-ending delays on electrical work, ridiculous threads needing to be deleted from what is usually the friendliest place on the internet (WTF?), and now these decals. I'm going to bed. Happy thoughts for tomorrow.

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:45 pm 
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First world DIY problems.

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Mon Jul 16, 2012 10:50 pm 
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p_wats wrote:
First world DIY problems.


Yes, I'm trolling myself...

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:38 am 
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Question: Are you using clear or white backing?

Clear is a bitch but I've got it down. White is a cake walk and I've yet to screw one up.

For clear I recommend decal applier. It makes it slide on great. Takes a little longer to dry but who cares if it is on right.

I guess I should ask, what issues were you having exactly? Stetching? Ends curling and you can't get them uncurled?

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 5:52 am 
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TNblueshawk wrote:
I guess I should ask, what issues were you having exactly?
+1. Is there a "repetitive failure mode" or is it a mix of different problems?

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:07 am 
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So the pro-blablabla thread got deleted last night?!


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:45 am 
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duhvoodooman wrote:
TNblueshawk wrote:
I guess I should ask, what issues were you having exactly?
+1. Is there a "repetitive failure mode" or is it a mix of different problems?


Thanks guys, at first I was having amateur issues just from having forgotten how to do it properly, but in the end I could never get the decal applied evenly without wrinkling or folding.

I've always disliked working with them and don't actually have a regular supplier near for to buy new sheets anyway, so it's no big loss--more of a frustration. I'm going to try some hand lettered/painted on the next non-1590A builds I do.

Kunfuz wrote:
So the pro-blablabla thread got deleted last night?!


Guess so. It seems to have disappeared.

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:54 am 
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I also hated ws decals until I started hitting them with a light coat of clear coat. No more curled edges, no more stretched out images. YMMV cuz waterslides are SATAN! :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:43 am 
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rocko1369 wrote:
I also hated ws decals until I started hitting them with a light coat of clear coat. No more curled edges, no more stretched out images. YMMV cuz waterslides are SATAN! :lol:


I even did that yesterday too! The main problem for me was getting them off the backing evenly without folding/wrinkling...

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:37 am 
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Has it been particularly dry up there? I used to have problems in low humidity. I switched to stickers a year or two ago and never looked back.

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 8:57 am 
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+1 for stickers! Both clear and white.


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 9:19 am 
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p_wats wrote:
rocko1369 wrote:
I also hated ws decals until I started hitting them with a light coat of clear coat. No more curled edges, no more stretched out images.
I even did that yesterday too! The main problem for me was getting them off the backing evenly without folding/wrinkling...
The clearcoat is definitely a major help in giving the waterslide decals more "body". I use the clear waterslide stock from Hemmi Papilio and have had excellent luck with it. The application method I use is to apply a drop or two of their decal mounting fluid to the enclosure surface and spread it around the entire decal area. I then immerse the decal in lukewarm water for about 30 seconds, and with wet fingertips, slide it off the backing paper by about 1/2". I then position that exposed end of the decal onto the enclosure, hold it in place with three fingertips, and s-l-o-w-l-y slide the backing paper out with the other hand. I find that if I do it this way, almost no air bubbles remain under the decal. Next, I pat the top of the decal dry with a paper towel, adjust the position of the decal as necessary (that mounting fluid really helps for this), and then gently squeeze the excess water and any air bubbles out from under the decal with a squeegee. I'll still lose the occasional decal with this method, but I've gotten my success rate up to about 90%.

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:07 am 
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SugarBear wrote:
Has it been particularly dry up there? I used to have problems in low humidity. I switched to stickers a year or two ago and never looked back.


It's actually been really humid lately. That said, I've had this old pack of decals for a VERY long time, so maybe they lose stability over time?

Kunfuz wrote:
+1 for stickers! Both clear and white.


I think that's where I'm headed for now, as I rarely build in non-tins anyway...

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:09 am 
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duhvoodooman wrote:
The clearcoat is definitely a major help in giving the waterslide decals more "body". I use the clear waterslide stock from Hemmi Papilio and have had excellent luck with it. The application method I use is to apply a drop or two of their decal mounting fluid to the enclosure surface and spread it around the entire decal area. I then immerse the decal in lukewarm water for about 30 seconds, and with wet fingertips, slide it off the backing paper by about 1/2". I then position that exposed end of the decal onto the enclosure, hold it in place with three fingertips, and s-l-o-w-l-y slide the backing paper out with the other hand. I find that if I do it this way, almost no air bubbles remain under the decal. Next, I pat the top of the decal dry with a paper towel, adjust the position of the decal as necessary (that mounting fluid really helps for this), and then gently squeeze the excess water and any air bubbles out from under the decal with a squeegee. I'll still lose the occasional decal with this method, but I've gotten my success rate up to about 90%.


Thanks for that! If I give it another go I'll definitely try these steps.

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Kunfuz wrote:
I wanna make nasty things to the purple/green one!
Sexy as ass!

Dog Is Blue - Music / pwats.com - Cartoons


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 10:59 am 
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I guess enough time has passed for me to forget my waterslide decal trauma because I'm getting ready to have a go at a couple. I can definitely understand your frustration. Last time I burned through an entire pack of paper before I got one sheet of prints I could use. Then I sanded through the decal after I finally got it clearcoated on the enclosure. I hope it goes smoother this time around, thanks for all the tips everybody.


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 2:04 pm 
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SugarBear wrote:
Has it been particularly dry up there? I used to have problems in low humidity. I switched to stickers a year or two ago and never looked back.


Ok I'll ask the dumb question since I am a water slide disaster in the works. What brand stickers are you using?


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:21 pm 
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The Papilio ones DVM mentioned I use...becuase of his recommendation actually.

P, are you using clear or white? I assume clear since your pedals are some darker colors?

Sounds like you are moving on, but if you do give it a shot what DVM says of course works. He uses a squeegee to get the bubbles out. I use an eye glass cleaner and like he said wet 3 fingers and hold down the decal and push out the bubbles slowly.

The white backed ones I can do blindfolded, drunk at 2:00 am they are so easy. They are just a tad thicker and I guess it makes all the difference.

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powerpopguy wrote:
warm places theory sounds plausible. Occasionally, I wake up and think my snake is missing too, but it turns out it's just a chilly morning. :P


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 3:51 pm 
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TNblueshawk wrote:
The Papilio ones DVM mentioned I use...becuase of his recommendation actually.

P, are you using clear or white? I assume clear since your pedals are some darker colors?

Sounds like you are moving on, but if you do give it a shot what DVM says of course works. He uses a squeegee to get the bubbles out. I use an eye glass cleaner and like he said wet 3 fingers and hold down the decal and push out the bubbles slowly.

The white backed ones I can do blindfolded, drunk at 2:00 am they are so easy. They are just a tad thicker and I guess it makes all the difference.


I'm using clear, but I just got an entire sheet of about 40 clear vinyl decals printed locally for $4.50, so I think that's the route I'll be going from now on!

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Kunfuz wrote:
I wanna make nasty things to the purple/green one!
Sexy as ass!

Dog Is Blue - Music / pwats.com - Cartoons


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 4:25 pm 
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JohnL wrote:
SugarBear wrote:
Has it been particularly dry up there? I used to have problems in low humidity. I switched to stickers a year or two ago and never looked back.


Ok I'll ask the dumb question since I am a water slide disaster in the works. What brand stickers are you using?


I buy the house brand at Office Depot. But...it's expensive...and you can find them much cheaper online. I just never think to order them...I end up running out and needing one, and then go buy a new pack.

I print mine off at the church because we have a pretty fancy machine up there that renders the graphics extremely well. Fit about 6 to a page (I guess that depends on the size of the enclosure). Once you figure out the trick to getting them down in the correct position you're golden.


TNblueshawk wrote:
The Papilio ones DVM mentioned I use...becuase of his recommendation actually.


The Papilio water slides were the absolutely best ones I worked with. I don't know what the difference is, but the seemed to be able to slide off straight and take a little more abuse.

p_wats wrote:
I'm using clear, but I just got an entire sheet of about 40 clear vinyl decals printed locally for $4.50, so I think that's the route I'll be going from now on!


Nice!

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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 6:47 pm 
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I like the Papilio white vinyl for inkjet as well. I order a couple of sample sheets and plan on getting more.

I picked up some Avery stuff at Stapes (both clear and white) and I hate it.


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:18 pm 
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Hey man where's the show?


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Tue Jul 17, 2012 7:30 pm 
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FF_Pedals wrote:
Hey man where's the show?


I forgot you were in Toronto! We're playing at the Silver Dollar at College & Spadina at 10pm.

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Kunfuz wrote:
I wanna make nasty things to the purple/green one!
Sexy as ass!

Dog Is Blue - Music / pwats.com - Cartoons


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 4:59 am 
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p_wats wrote:
FF_Pedals wrote:
Hey man where's the show?


I forgot you were in Toronto! We're playing at the Silver Dollar at College & Spadina at 10pm.



Cool! I was there last Friday. Well the one before last...


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 Post subject: Re: Waterslide decals are the bane of my existence
PostPosted: Wed Jul 18, 2012 9:29 am 
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ok. slightly off topic. what section of the office supply stores (staples, office max) is this in. i looked once but couldn't find it. and the 17 year old brain dead employee was no help. (no offense to any 17 year old brain dead people reading this.)

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