Build Your Own Clone Message Board

This is a rough desktop capture video of me running through the process of making a schematic and then a PCB layout. There is no audio or text annotation. Just some background music and me going through the process. Fast.

I plan to do a more detailed version in the future with either voice audio or text. But for now, this will give you an idea of how it all works.

Obviously, I didn't spend much time optimizing the layout. I didn't even load any design rules, which is important for fabrication. The idea was to show the whole process from start to finish, and I think the video is fairly representative of that process.

Note: I'm using the Guass-Markov parts library found here: http://gaussmarkov.net/wordpress/tools/ ... libraries/

Note 2: I use the command bar a lot to type in commands. So keep your eyes on that (at the top of the screen).

I've posted it on vimeo:
https://vimeo.com/42108891

Or, you can download the uncompressed version from DropBox and watch it non-streaming:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dlzu3nqg61wym2h/tLaZf0HZhb


It's interesting for me to watch it so that I can see how non-linear my thought process is.

And oh yeah: I missed one of the tie points (on the output coupling cap). Didn't notice until I watched the video.

Thanks man! Saved and will be viewed in slomo

CJ, you RULE!!

I've been teaching myself Eagle by working on my first schematic all last week, and I got super frustrated when I couldn't find a few things in the library (namely a 2N5457 and the in/out symbols.. Between your video and the pedal parts library I didn't know existed, I may actually get past the schematic stage and into the board layout!

Many thanks, you just saved me from asking you the first five questions I've been trying not to bother you with..

Cool. Glad somebody got a little something out of it.

Really Enjoyed the video yesterday night, especially when the FMN song kicks in! hehe

Sooner or later i'll start fooling around with that software...

hell yeah FNM.

sweet vid, Forrest. Might have to give Eagle another go, you made it look so easy!

You make it look so simple!
I too think I'll give it another try with something that I'm familiar with, something easy.

thank you!

Thanks, Forrest. Really appreciate the vid. I see you put your ground pour in first. That makes a lot of sense. I could see the layout updating as you moved parts after laying the 9v plane, so that was cool. I'd be curious to see the more detailed video with your explanation of why you do things and considerations that you make while in the moment. My weakest process right now is getting a clean layout, but with your insight over the last few days, it has helped me immensely. Thanks, man.

I actually normally do both the top and bottom pour first. This video was totally off the cuff. It was a "first take" and I thought at first that I wouldn't even do a top layer pour, but then half way through I thought it would be beneficial to show how it's down.


I will definitely do this in the near future. I just don't have a mic suitable for computer stuff. I need one of those douchebag headsets, haha,


I think it's important to keep one thing in mind about Eagle: focus on getting your schematic as technically correct as you can. If it's right, then you almost can't make a wrong PCB layout. I say almost because I've actually made a bad layout with a perfect schematic. I left a component unconnected on the layout, and Eagle doesn't check for that, for some reason. So make sure there are no airwires when you are done.

jeez that's reassuring. and really strange.

Anyway thanks entirely to Forrest, I completed my first Eagle schematic today, and am now in the layout stage. I tried to do a ground and power pour first, and crashed and burned pretty badly on the layout. Doing the pours first is definitely not intuitive to me yet. Might have to work in reverse for now.. in any case, still psyched to be making headway in Eagle!

Thanks for sharing Effdub! It was fun to watch.

I think they do that so that you have the option to leave certain things off the board if you wanted to without it throwing errors. Like if you had a diode selector switch that was on the schematic but intended to be wired off-board, you could just leave those parts unconnected. In Eagle, if it's on the schematic, it will be in the layout file. So it's nice not to have to place something on the PCB.


There's no right way. I just do better when I have less airwires to look at from the beginning. The best way to do that is to have the pours done before you start routing (or sometimes placing the parts).

You can also do multiple pours (or planes) on each side. For example, you might want to do two planes on the top side; one for +9v and one for VREF. Or you might want to have half a ground plane on top as well. Just draw two polygons and name the same as the net you want them to "attach" to (such as +9v, VA, VB, GND, whatever).

Take a look at the layout image for the Stutter Trem. There are actually three planes on top: +9v, VA, and a skinny little GND plane running down the middle to isolate the LFO from the audio. I did a similar setup for the STM as well, albeit a little less complicated.

There are instances where on the schematic a part will look connected and it isn't. Running the DCR on the schematic will catch this, but since the DCR throws many erroneous errors for DIY guys, we tend not to use it.

And you'll find everyone has their own work flow, so there is no "right" was per se. I'm on the complete other side from Forrest, I can't stand having pours done while laying out traces because the pour does not update automatically (at least not in Eagle 5, haven't used 6 really at all, not sure if it's changed), so I can't see where traces are. Yes, you can "break" the ground pour by moving one of its boundaries and make it go away, but then you have to do that every time you hit the ratsnest button and want to adjust a trace. So I leave pours for last if I use them at all (I tend not; of the traces you should route by hand, power and ground are WAY up there, but simple projects are forgiving so pours can be used and you'll be fine).

Generally schematics have very good signal flow and power/grounding, so if you arrange the parts in the same order as the schematic more/less, doing layouts is much easier. I almost have to have the schematic printed in front of me when I start a layout so I can get things sorted quickly.

What I meant was that I left a component that was not connected by a trace on the layout. It was connected on the schematic. The design rule check doesn't verify that all parts are routed with traces. At least no on my version, which is 5.6.0.

In a really dense layout, it can be easy to miss a tiny airwire.


I can see it fine on mine (5.6.0). Lay down a couple traces and then run ratsnest. The pour updates immediately. You can see it my video in the first post. It's not automatic on each completed trace, but typing "rat" takes less than a second.

But yes, I agree that there is no wrong way. Whatever way works best for the individual is the "right" way.

Every bit of this conversation is helpful to me (and probably twanzilla too). Plus- diving into Eagle has improved my schematic knowledge, which is a big bonus.

Hit the ratsnest button, there is an airwire count in the lower left corner of the window. But yes, finding air wires can be an SOB. I've had to turn off all of the layers just to see them some times. I attached a screen shot, sorry, it's fullsized so expect a monster image.



Yes, but if you want to move a trace after you run ratsnest, the pour does not update until you hit ratsnest again. So you end up re-routing traces and the old outline is there in the pour, but the new traces end up being in a sea of blue from the pour until you hit ratsnest again. That is the annoying part for me.

Sonofabitch! Thanks for that. I had no idea.


I just type "rat"+enter a lot when I'm rerouting. I guess I've gotten used to it.

I find that if I do the pour last, I have already manually routed all the ground and power connections, and then I have to rip them up. Just the way my mind works. I don't want to have to keep track of which airwires don't need to be routed. I'd rather they just go away as soon as possible.

Right click on the net, select properties, and check the box "airwires hidden" in the lower left hand corner. I don't know how to undo this, but that's how you can hide them from the get go.

EDITED

I'll have to check that out.

But I still think I'll probably do the pours first since it's what I'm used to.

It only hides the airwires of a single net, not all of the air wires (that is done via the layers). I provided a clarification of my above post below:

Here is a link to a series of 13 video tutorials on Eagle, not pedal stuff specifically but a pretty good series all in all (Still want to see yours CJ!!)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qG0O9LKH-_E

I will have to watch at home.

As cool as this seems and as interested as I am, I am afraid to get "into" this part of it.

My DIY addiction, as I see it, currently: "I can stop any time I want, man!"

My DIY, as I fear it may turn out, after getting "into" Eagle (or even learning how the F stripboard works ): "Once I hit the needle, I knew there was no turning back."